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For those of you just joining us – We last we heard from our heroes – Vox has just posted a set of five passages from the first five books of the bible and asked Jamsco to answer some questions about each of them. . . .

Vox, I am impressed with your list. They make a good representative of the Aprivistan viewpoint. I hope to get to all of them soon. But as you suggest, I will pick one – Genesis.

I pick this one because –
(A) It was first on your list.
(B) It requires the simplest response, and
(C) It is about this one that I am the most intrigued to see you response to my response. So:

Regarding Genesis 3:9

But the LORD God called to the man, “Where are you?”

You ask:
There are three possibilities here. Either (1)God was lying to the man about not knowing where he was, (2) He was asking rhetorical questions to which He already knew the answer, or (3) He did not know where the man was and did not know – as opposed to correctly deduced – that the man had eaten from the tree that He had commended him not to eat from. I ask TRP, which he believes to be the correct answer?

I Choose 2 – God knew where Adam was.

I know this to be the right choice, because of Psalm 139:

    7 Where can I go from your Spirit?
       Where can I flee from your presence?
    8 If I go up to the heavens, you are there;
       if I make my bed in the depths, you are there.
    9 If I rise on the wings of the dawn,
       if I settle on the far side of the sea,
    10 even there your hand will guide me,
       your right hand will hold me fast.
    11 If I say, “Surely the darkness will hide me
       and the light become night around me,”
    12 even the darkness will not be dark to you;
       the night will shine like the day,
       for darkness is as light to you.

Maybe you should add this to your list of things that God knows: God sees where people are.

And I’ll request this in advance this time: Vox, when you respond, don’t just say I’m crazy. Tell us specifically how you read the passages (Genesis and Psalms).


I’d like to point out that Bethyada has said in the comments that we should choose one topic. I agree that Vox and I have been all of over the place. I hope that choosing one bible passage to focus on narrows our scope a little.

Also, Dominic says that I haven’t made many strong proactive arguments. I agree that at this point I have been mostly reacting to Vox’s unique theology. I hope to remedy this soon.

There is a strange similarity between omniderigistes and the New Atheists. Both groups take a small number of specific Bible verses, assign one reasonable interpretation to them, and then argue that it is the only possible interpretation in defiance of numerous equally possible alternatives that are better supported by historical facts, logic and other Bible verses.
– Vox Day 11/22/2007

In fact, this is also a very good example of the very omniderigiste/atheist error that I mentioned in my first post on the matter:

1. Take a Bible verse
2. Assign a possible meaning to it.
3. Insist this is the ONLY possible meaning, even when the meaning doesn’t make sense. (In this case, the problem is apparent a priori, but usually it is only evident when considered in context with other, contradictory verses.)
4. Ignore all other plausible interpretations, especially more logical and Biblically supported ones.

– Vox Day 11/26/2007

Omniderigent logic is atheist logic.
– Vox Day 11/27/2007 (Comments)

After wading through a lot of atheist logic, I’ve come to realize the inherent connections between omniderigence and atheist thinking.
– Vox Day 11/27/2007 (Comments)

Vox – Your readers and I are clear that this is what you think. We get it. At least I do, and despite what you say, your readers have pretty good reading comprehension, even the ones who disagree with you. So in case you were thinking about using it as part of your response to my next post, a word to the wise: Maybe four times in a week is enough.

This is not to say that you have given any evidence to support this claim. Regarding Free Will – show me where I have denied that humans have it.

And regarding the series of four steps listed above. Vox, are you aware that this is what anyone thinks about anyone else who uses the Bible to disagree with them? Don’t you find it coincidental that you think this of the two groups you have primarily spent your time debating religious matters with?

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November 2007